In short · Summary by AI
Jason Bateman, Sean Hayes, and Will Arnett welcome Coleman Domingo to SmartLess, and the conversation covers his childhood, the gay chat line prank, his path from theater to television, his work on Michael and Fear the Walking Dead, and his reflections on aging and success. The episode ends with the hosts praising his artistry and bonding over shared career and life experiences.
- The hosts open with a playful cold-open bit about the gay chat line 'Pardon Sir,' which Sean Hayes recounts from calling it as a teenager and getting caught by his mom with the bill.
- Will Arnett shares a story about a scam caller and says the scammer kept going after him even when he was distracted.
- Coleman Domingo describes being the 'knee baby' of four kids from West Philly and being pushed toward acting by a Temple University teacher while he was studying journalism.
- He worked bartending jobs for years alongside his theater career, and was on the verge of leaving the industry at around age 44 before a manager meeting changed his trajectory.
- Domingo recounts landing Fear the Walking Dead and The Get Down around the same time, choosing Fear, and later directing and producing on the show.
- On playing Joe Jackson in Michael, he says he researched him as a father shaped by his era, and cites the line 'I beat him all the way to the bank' as shaping his portrayal.
- The guests discuss aging, saying no more judgment and saying no without qualifiers, and Domingo calls his laugh lines a sign he has lived a joyful life.
Cold open and chat line
0:04Hey guys, welcome to another fresh cold open. Oh, >> on Smartless. Oh, >> is this a fresh one? >> Uh, I'm happy to have you two here guest starring in Excited to be here and see you guys. Really incredible. >> Been wanting to get you guys in a cold open for a while. >> Just like your pictures. >> So, [music] what what do you guys understand a cold open to be?
0:24Do you think it is as uh >> we just want to blast into it and get into the show? >> Yeah, I know. I know what it is. It's probably short. >> You don't think it has anything to do with temperature or anything like that? >> No. And I don't think we belabor it in the way that you are. Okay. But anyway. >> All right.
0:37So, you just want to get into the show then? >> Yeah. I just want to say, "Hey, welcome. It's all new." >> Oh, [music] okay. Welcome. It's all new smart
0:57[music] less. >> Wait, there was something that I wanted to talk about. What were we talking about the other night at dinner? >> You wanted to talk about your love for me and for Shawn. And go ahead. We're ready to listen. Oh, no. There's two things. Yeah. You want to talk about the gay chat line and you want >> the gay [laughter] chat line >> and you want to talk about >> Yeah.
1:16What was it called? It was manhole. >> I looked it up. I looked it up. It's I thought it was called manhole. It was called pardon sir. >> Pardon pardon sir. >> Yeah. >> That's like that's like you're on a crowded subway. >> So Sean, tell the story. So you you crowded subway. Um pardon sir. Uh you your mom came to you one day.
Pardon Sir and scam calls
1:33How old were you? You were like 17 maybe. >> Yeah 17 or 18 or somewhere [music] around 17 19. And I would go downstairs to the phone in the basement and I would go I would call like a gay chat line like a party line like hey what's going on and sure and I didn't know that it was like I don't know back then it was like two bucks a minute or five bucks a minute I don't know some crazy kind of money and I'd talk and talk and talk and my mom came to me with the bill she's like are you calling now it's called
1:58pardon sir or whatever it is what cuz she called it and found out that what it was and I was like oh I was so embarrassed I was like oh that's just a that's just a joke you weren't out yet no uh Uh, I was like, "That's just a joke. We were just joking around. Isn't that funny? >> What's funny about it?
2:15>> Funny. [laughter] >> There's nothing funny about it. >> Isn't that funny?" >> Okay, so that's pardon, sir, Shaunie. Now, what about this manhole? >> Yeah, exactly. >> But you [laughter] were >> totally >> And I was like, my only comeback was at least I have two eyes. No, I didn't say that. I didn't say that.
2:32>> Sean and No, but she was really she was really And then I was Anyway, who cares? It was very embarrassing. I care. Like >> I care. >> And the other day And then the other day, like a week ago, Will will FaceTime me and while I was on my laptop FaceTiming with him, my phone rings and it's one of those people from another country that asked for told me like >> racist.
2:57What? What? What are you talking about? >> Told me I had a phone bank like like a scam. >> Yeah. Like I had a I don't know like an overdue bill or something. They need my information. And so Will, I put on speaker and Will says, "I can see you. I can see you. God is in you. God is in you." [laughter] And >> and the guy's like, "Oh, and by the way," the guy was undeterred.
3:19He's like, "Okay, that's no problem." So So let's get to the thing. >> Yeah. I mean, he these scammers, JB, I mean, they don't they keep their eye on the prize. Amazing. I said so much gibberish to him. What was the uh when you got the when you looked at your phone of the incoming call, did it say unknown caller?
3:39>> No, it said the number and then the curiosity always wins. I was like, who is that? So, >> count on guys like you. >> I heard about the cat, right? You heard about the cat with the curiosity. What happened? >> Yeah, it ended up killing [laughter] him. >> It ended up killing him. >> What about all the emails?
3:53Do you guys do you guys get a thousand emails a day that are that are just fishing, you know, with a link, you know, like it looks like an Apple bill or Amazon bill or something? Your your Amazon bill is just, you know, you click here and adjust it. >> I know. And then your life's over. If you click on that thing, you're hacked.
4:12You're this. I I'm very good about just deleting anything that looks a little sideways. Are you Are you bad at that, Shnie? >> I I do that, too. But I always make sure I >> I say something funny so they know it's me. Like if I forward it to um my tax guy or whatever, I'll be like, "Hey, >> I'll say like, you know, I'll do a joke so he knows I'm not forwarding."
4:35>> Did you say your tax evasion guy? >> Tax evasion guy. >> You didn't say [clears throat] tax evasion guy. Did you say? >> Why is he based in the Cayman's? Why is he in the Cayman? [laughter] >> Um that's where he lives. >> I just wanted to have a quick I said why is that? Um what I was saying documentaries, this is a new thing.
4:50Do you guys have There's so many what they call documentaries out now about people and then it feels like a lot of them are endorsed by the person and they're part of it. >> Yes. Yes. >> And it half of them feel like just >> puff pieces. >> Yeah. Puff pieces like they're they're glazing themselves like it's to sell them and their brand.
5:12Is that does that feel accurate? So I have people go like, "Oh, did you see the such and such documentary?" I'm like, >> "I don't know. The term documentary is a bit of a stretch here. Feels like a this feels like a real like a self-promotional real, >> right? Yeah. Yeah, [clears throat] that's interesting.
5:26>> Yeah, there there are there are some of those. Yeah. But uh but man, the ones that aren't I'm such a documentary. >> No, the good there's so many good ones. Yeah, of course. >> Speaking of films that I love, I saw a film last night that is not a new film, so I'm I'm I'm late to this. Um as is most >> fun when he does this.
5:42>> Superman. Is it Superman? >> The film is called Birth and it's it's directed by Jonathan Glazer. Oh, it's so good. >> Nicole Kibbon film. Good lord, is this film good. >> Really? When did it come out? >> It's so 2004 or something like that. Yeah. >> It was a movie he did right after Sexy Beast. >> Yeah.
6:00I mean, I think it it moves slowly, but I love stuff like that. Mia, is it good? And then I looked at I looked it up online. Didn't make any money. Got terrible reviews. And I'm like, well, I said, well, then my taste is in my ass. It's like in other words like you know I mean I try to make stuff and like if I turned that in I would think >> oh my god you have just like here you know you're here comes the rest of your career pal nice nice work and then like you just get you know no money no no
6:32reviews no nothing like it doesn't do well at all like what are you supposed to do with with if you got taste like that I I guess I got I'm doing something wrong. No, I don't know what happened. >> There's no there's no rhyme or reason to it, I don't think. >> I think the Rotten Tomatoes thing is wild, too.
6:49Now, like something will get 90% or 100% of Rotten Tomatoes and then I'll see it and like I don't think it's like I don't think it's that great or vice >> versa. But at least with that, it's an aggregator. So, you're you're you're seeing a consensus and this film had a consensus >> and it's fresh if it's over 60%.
7:02So, that >> but what I'm saying is the is the is the critic sometimes kind of gets seduced by I agree. I agree. There were a couple films in the last couple years where everybody was like bandwagon TV shows and films and they all jump on it and it's the water cool water cooler effect. I think >> I did look at like a couple of my favorite critics though gave it gave it rave reviews like the guy in the New York Times and the New Yorker like they loved it and I guess it was just maybe
7:31just so many people reviewed it it brought it down or I don't know but man is it good birth. I think film reviews are pretty tough to I don't know. I have such a I know >> uh you know uh Rotten Tomatoes in in Canada is called Rotten Tomatoes. Did you guys know that? >> Is that right? [laughter] >> Um so so is that right?
7:44E >> so um speaking of uh speaking of critically acclaimed that's what our guest today is answer. He's accumulated 146 nominations, 46 wins nominated for two Academy Awards for best actor. BAFTAs, Critics's Choice has won an Emmy, got nominated for a bunch of other ones, Golden Globes, Olivier Awards, uh, Screen Actors Guild Award, you name it.
8:13He has an incredible [snorts] list of, uh, screen and sta and television and stage >> credits. Uh, uh, Shaunie, that you will, you're going to get a theater story out of this guy. He is he's a playwright. He's a performer. You know him from uh, Birth of a Nation. You know him from he was incredible as Joseph Joe Jackson in Michael.
8:36You know him from Disclosure Day. You know from the four season GUYS IT'S [screaming] GOT >> WAIT A MINUTE. THIS IS CRAZY. I was JUST OH MY GOD. I WAS JUST WATCHING you like on some Oh, I just watched Michael again last night and I was like I would kill to meet Coleman. I've never met and here you are.
8:55This is crazy. >> Good to finally meet you. We passed each other at events and stuff like that, but I've never been up because I get kind of weird and shocked in He moving you. You're like, [laughter] I'm in seat 3A. I got to get to my seat. Yeah, right. >> I'm such a huge huge fan of me, too. I'm such a thrilled to have you here, Co.
9:16Uh I I also just watched Michael this summer and I was blown away by your performance. Oh, >> thank you. Thank you. >> So good. >> Thank you, guys. What I mean that talk about something that does well. Um I mean that was did incredibly well. I mean people millions and millions of people watched that as you were talking about the rotten to Rotten Tomatoes.
9:36I was thinking that we got like >> panned with Rotten Tomatoes, you know, but yeah, Michael was panned with Rotten Tomatoes yet audiences yet audiences because I don't I felt like, you know, again, I think people jumped on the bandwagon or they they wanted a certain story about Michael Jackson and so they didn't they weren't able to look through the lens of what we were creating, but then their audiences swung the other way and the audience >> didn't did huge box office, didn't it?
10:00>> Huge. We made over a billion dollars. Yeah. Yeah. It's the highest grossing biopic ever made and the highest grossing one for Lionsgate. Yeah. >> That's amazing. And you guys said, "Hey, screw your critics. We're going to make a sequel." >> Dude, exactly. That's exactly [laughter] you're like, you know, but also what's what's beautiful cuz I feel Listen, all right, this is I just think that at some point I think I naturally maybe I just feel this way cuz I feel like criticism, you know, especially
10:30when it comes through the lens of like people, they want something and you're not if you're not delivering that, they're not able to see it through the lens. But an audience, I'd rather just follow someone's, you know, opinion of someone that I respect. You know what I mean? Somebody even on like on Twitter or or IG or something.
10:43Oh, I'll go see it because these people liked it and they're talking about it in the comments. >> I think that's the way it's going more and more, right? That that sort of social media um kind of crowdsourcing opinion I think is is driving a lot of box office. >> Yeah. Well, yeah, I think it's e I mean, I don't want to be the guy who who who uh uh you know, takes apart critics just because he's been on the uh on the short end of of bad reviews, but have >> we all we all have.
11:07>> Yeah. But but I I I do think it's really difficult now when I watch sometimes I'll I'll I'll see a review or whatever and then I'll look at the guy and I'll be like I don't want to watch anything that this guy likes. Like he and I don't have the same and it kind of goes to what you said Coleman. It's more about >> about aligning yourself with people who Jason talk about birth right like you go into these things and you and you go well yeah there are certain people who aren't going to like it but those aren't
11:33the kind of people that you would want to go and do something creative with. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Do you read Do you read uh all your stuff, Coleman? >> I don't read all of it. I like sometimes I feel like I sort of like put myself in a little bubble for a minute, but then at some point I want to sort of like pull back the blind and see see what people how they're responding to it.
11:48You know what I mean? But I really don't want it to take over the what the feeling I had about making it. You know what I mean? I'm not going to look at it the day after we premiere or something and [music] suddenly like, you know? >> Yeah. But it is sort of like it is it's I've always felt that since we we we we have a public job and we we our product is for the masses.
12:06Uh hopefully it it it does stand to reason that you would then look at what the public is saying about it. How is it being received for the audience you are trying to please? Um I I guess um >> it's true. It's true. But but you have to be careful what what you get, right? because I'm like I remember um recently I I guest hosted uh Jimmy Kimmel and I never I never I never guest hosted a show like that.
12:32So I I wanted to know so I went behind the blinds of Twitter and I went on there just to see how people were responding to it and it was overwhelmingly beautiful. But then I got like fixated on this one chick who was like you know you're you're too you're doing too much you know just calm down too much exuberance and I was [laughter] like mean.
12:48So I was like mad at her. So, but of course I turned it into part of the monologue the next day. I was like, you know, because I'm human and I wanted to know like how people were responding to it. >> You got to rightize it, right? I mean, it's like it was one person's opinion. It's not indicative of the whole thing.
13:03And even if it is everybody's opinion, it how did you feel about what you did? And and and what size should that be in your calculus as to, you know, whether it was a positive experience or not? >> Yeah. And also, but also I feel like art is so subjective as well. I feel like some people should [ __ ] hate it.
13:16some if you're making some really good art hopefully some it's polarizing in some way and people are like I'm not sure but what you know people want like even let's say the the Michael Jackson film I I wanted to make sure I gave some humanity to Joe Jackson and really made him a bit more complex than I think what anyone would want what assumed Joe Jackson to be and I thought that was my job but I feel like some people were like no I want more of the monster or like oh why'd you do that so I'm like
13:41you know I can't please everybody all I can do is try try to do >> pleasing everybody you're doing something wrong >> I loved I loved your portrayal of Joe Jack. I thought it was so layered even those moments where you thought he was going to blow up a Michael then he kind of went like okay >> and it just kind of and I thought that was really cool that it was really nuance and but but getting to the the sorry I just wanted to go back to that idea if you think and it just occurs to
14:04me and it's not a new idea so forgive me and believe me I used to read the critics of this podcast early on and and uh I was reminded how uh unoriginal my ideas are but you know that [laughter] the the idea that back in the day when there used to be especially when we went through these great uh um periods in show business in the sort of the 70s etc and TV and film where we had a lot of groundbreaking stuff and there were stuff that just we never heard of and went away a lot of those things were
14:32driven by art were driven by just trying to do the really cool interesting breakthrough you know groundbreaking material and it wasn't driven by uh marketing and look at box office and looking at >> you would never have a Robert Alman film No, you you never have any of those films because you know now they look at and they go they first thing they do is if they're making a films they go to their their sales department, their marketing department, they go can we sell this movie?
14:58>> And then they go to the awards department. Exactly. >> And then they go to the awards department as opposed to is this movie good? Is this something that that you know we like? And and people producers, directors, actors, studio chiefs would take a chance on something because everybody agreed that this was something that could be.
15:13Why do you think why do you think right now that people are so I know it's all it's money but I feel like you can't have a parasite or like you know what was that everything everywhere all at once so like imagine reading that I it doesn't sound like that movie would make any money >> scare the hell out of you if you're writing the check but it takes people to say we're going to take a chance on this because we believe in this good art and then it succeeds >> it it is money it is money Coleman I
15:37think that also a lot of these big companies that make the decisions that give the that lend the money or give the money to to create these projects films TV whatever uh these companies are now big uh publicly traded companies that have to and their CEO and chairman have to answer to their shareholders, right?
15:50So they have a they're like, "Hey, I have a fiscal uh obligation to our shareholders and this doesn't meet that fit that criteria and and it's just >> straight business. >> It doesn't it doesn't really necessarily work with art." >> No. >> Yeah. >> Speaking of art, speaking of selling something to the Just real quickly, uh Willie, I saw the Behemoth trailer two days ago.
16:12I think it was two days ago or one day ago. >> It looks freaking great. I mean, and and you you actually start the trailer and finish the trailer and it's so exciting to see you up there. Um, but that movie looks fantastic. Um, Pedro Pascal Gilroy. Yeah, >> Pedro is amazing in it. I'll just say Pedro Pascal is amazing at it.
16:31He's he's God, he's the best. And Tony, you know, the great Tony Gilroy and Olivia Wild and Eva Victor are some great people. So, excited for people to see. >> I can't wait to see it. Yeah. >> Um, Coleman, can I just ask you a couple questions about Joe Jackson? I know you're sick of talking. >> One questioner.
16:47No vote. >> Sorry, Coleman. We're really sorry about Okay, go ahead. >> I was just such a huge fan of Michael Jackson growing up. Just massive fan. And um, what was it like? Like, did you talk to the family? Did you talk what was the prep like? Like, and were you petrified? Because he is such a well-known person.
17:06>> I wasn't petrified. >> He ran the family. you you know the the the moment I I got the offer I was like I was like let me see how he lives in me and then I started to do some research cuz I'm like I think I know who Joe Jackson was but he just seemed like a a typical villain because his eyebrows were up high and all that stuff.
17:21light blue eyes and crazy looking Jerry curl and I was like let me get beyond that and see do do some research and I really looked at him as sort of you know I really looked at him just being a man who was born pre- civil rights and you know to you're very modest and really had um limited education limited access but he had these kids who have talent and they they really relied on him to like push them to become the best >> and I thought well he gave everything he had I mean so let me look through the
17:48lens of a father I'm not going to look at the lens that everyone else sees him as. How does Joe see himself? And then there was one interview that I thought was very interesting. There one interview and Joe sitting there and they're like, you know, Michael's talked about, you know, Michael's talked about, you know, his abuse and, you know, how he was he was beat or or what he say and and he would vomit when whenever you came into the room.
18:07And Joe Joe Jackson literally sat back there with a little smile. He said, "He said that really?" Oh, okay. He said, "Well, I beat him, but I beat him all the way to the bank." And I was like, [laughter] >> "Wow." Oh, >> and I thought that was interesting because he said because you know child rearing was different back then.
18:22He was like it was rigor, it was discipline and I made sure you were the best you could be so you can get out of your circumstance. So for me that's how I framed Joe Jackson. And then I went to some and then I went to some conversations with the beautiful thing is Jafar Jackson who's Germaine Jackson's son played Michael.
18:37So I had him as of like hey tell me you know how was your relationship with your grandpa? and he said, "Oh, pop pop." And there was so much love that, you know, whether he or I talked to um Marlon Jackson, a few others. And they always said, they were like, "Oh, he's a complicated man, but you know, he loved me and I love my dad."
18:57>> And so, I wanted to lean into that about about what the family what's behind the closed doors. You know, I saw videos of Joe Jackson Day because they were Jehovah Witnesses, so they didn't have, you know, birthdays or anything, but they had Joe Jackson Day. And it's just a simple video I saw with them sitting around he and Catherine and the kids and the grandkids and I'm like oh they're just a typical family like anybody else and I'm sure they have problems like anybody else and it's a big ass family.
19:19So um but they're the most successful family and there would be honestly there would be no >> Michael Jackson or Jackson clan if it wasn't for Joe Jackson. So I feel like I wanted to look at it through Joe's lens. So that's what I did. >> Yeah. >> Fascinating family. >> Um Willie start us at start us at the top.
19:37Tell us about Coleman. Where did Coleman come from, Will? Where are you from? >> Take us through your research, Will. >> So Coleman, if I'm If I'm You're You're from West Philly. >> Yes. Born and raised. >> Is that right? >> Yeah. >> Born and raised. One of five kids. Is that right? >> No. Uh four. >> Four kids?
19:54Yeah. Four kids. Sorry. One of four kids. One off. >> Youngest. >> Uh um middle boy. I was the youngest for a long time. So they call it the knee baby. So I was like 12 years old before my younger brother was born. So I was the baby. >> Wait. Wait. That's the knee baby. >> The knee baby is like you got one on the knee and then you're having another one.
20:11[laughter] >> That's hilarious. >> I never heard that. >> Uhhuh. >> And and you had you had you didn't come from a family of performers. Your parents weren't performers. Nothing like that. But you had a am I right in saying that you had a you had a teacher who encouraged you to pursue acting. There was like a pivotal teacher in your life.
20:29Is that true? Tell me. To me, I was I mean, it's probably hard for many people to believe these, but I was very shy. I and I had a lot of, you know, whether I had a lisp, I I was not cool. I was, you know, from, you know, lower middle- class family. I was wearing my older brother and older sister's hand-me-down clothes.
20:44So, by the time I go to college, I was I just wanted to be something else. So, I started I actually took an acting class as an elective. And because my mother said, "Take something to get you outside of yourself. You know, I know you she knew me to be a bit more funnier and have a bit more personality, but I didn't show it outside."
20:57So, I took this one class as teacher Chris and it was just acting 101 at Temple University uh when I was studying journalism. Another career where I thought like I was just going to be a newspaper writer and stay behind the scenes. >> You just be on your own. >> Be in a dark be in a dark room. Exactly.
21:15[laughter] And nobody bothered me. >> So, but then I took this class and he said um he pulled me aside one day said, "Hey, have you ever thought about acting as a profession?" And I said, "I don't even know what I don't even know what you're talking about. Like, what is that? What is acting as a profession?"
21:28you know, my as the first kid in my family to go to college, it I was supposed to go out and get a job and a job with benefits, you know what I mean? It was no like the idea of me being an artist didn't even make sense. So, he said uh he said, "I'd be very curious if you did." Cuz he said, "I think you have a gift."
21:42And I and I said, "Oh." He said, "I think you have a gift and I'd be very curious if you pursue that gift." >> Oh, yeah. >> So, it was like a mic drop. And I was like, and I didn't know until um some friends of mine tell me I'm at what at anagram 8, which is the challenger. You know, I like to be I like a challenge.
22:00So, that was like a challenge like I'd be curious. And I'm like, I like that challenge. So, I started taking I started taking some theater classes off campus from Temple University because I didn't I sort of kept it as my little secret. I would take >> acting classes like breathing exercises and laying on the floor, filling myself up with orange juice and [ __ ] like that.
22:17All this wonderful stuff. And I love being in the theater. I was like, "Wow, this is what I want to do. I want to be in the theater." So, I was a theater rat for most of my career, >> you know, and that was very fulfilling, you know, for >> And you Yeah. And you were like, is it true that I I I I read somewhere that you you were you were working in the theater, but you also had like other jobs going on.
22:35I always had hustles. Yeah. >> You talked about like take taking your final bow and 15 minutes later you were serving drinks. >> Oh, yeah. I worked at Manhattan Class Company in New York City, a beautiful off Broadway theater. I literally would like, you know, bow in this. I did this show with John Randall called Bright Ideas.
22:53I'll never forget it. It was one of my first off Broadway shows. And I took took a bow, got up and had it timed. I would get up, rip off my costumes, which I'm sure cost thousands of dollars, you know, call a cab, get over to the 55 bar in the West Village, and suddenly within 15 minutes, I cuz I was like, I I can I have to be late for my shift by 15 minutes cuz um the show started at 7:30.
23:14We were done at like 8:59. Got it over there. Next thing you know, I was like, "Hi, what can I get you?" I literally walked in the door and went straight to the bar because I need I needed that hustle. I was off Broadway. I was getting paid like 350 bucks a week as you and then like I needed, you know, to live in New York.
23:30I was like, I had to have that job. >> Sure. >> We'll be right back. >> And now back to the show. What what was the first So then what was the first gig where you were able to give up that that day job like that or that that that gap job of whether it was bartending or whatever. Do you remember >> for a long time when I tell you for a long time because I think I was always afraid of being broke.
23:57I always kept a bartending job. Even when I was on Broadway, I would still have like, oh, I'm dude, I was I was on Broadway and passing strange and still like, you know, on a Monday night, I'm like, I'll pick up that shift because I was afraid it wasn't going to last. I was always it was that roller coaster and, you know, like, let me just ride this out.
24:15But it was for a long I would say from like 20 years of my career and I've been doing this now for what 35 36 years >> and I think I think I just stopped having a side job. I think [laughter] >> but I mean like But but you mentioned that passing strange >> you're like right after this podcast I have to go back I got I [laughter] got to go pick up a shift you guys like I don't know if it's going to last >> but but passing it's funny you mentioned passing strange that was filmed by Spike
24:43Lee. Am I right about that? >> Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. But literally when that show closed I went back to bartending. >> I my career was always these highs has been these highs and lows where I was always doing these shows that were in my theater career was doing these shows that had no intention of going to Broadway.
24:58Like I did um show me I did a show called um Scots Boys at the Vineyard Theater with uh Susan Strowman. The final collaboration between Cander and Neb that started out you know we went to off Broadway at the Vineyard Theater. They went to the Guthrie. It it really is these really weird pieces of theater that somehow end up in the commercial space.
25:17So then I kept really I was just going to be an avanguard actor and then like get a rent stabilized apartment and that was fine for me and then my career started do other things. >> But you were doing and you're going all over the place. You were in Australia, you were in you were in the UK, like you were you were really really doing the theater.
25:33>> Yeah. And also I mean that's the thing too because I've always I've always been um a multihyenet. I've always been a writer, a playwright. I write musicals. I write plays. I write I direct. >> Didn't you write? Didn't you write >> I wrote I wrote the I co-wrote the Donna Summer Donna Summer musical musical on Broadway.
25:49I co-wrote a show about Nat King Cole that was at the New York Theater Workshop last year. Um, so it's like people always know that even still if you can knock on my my trailer door and people like, "What are you doing?" I'm like, "Oh, writing a play or screenplay." Like it's just like I just I feel like those are my hobbies.
26:05>> Jason, what you know what Jason doing? He's watching TV. >> What's Jason doing? Jason, what are you doing? >> He's watching He's watching TV. >> My no my brain I I I I was that No, that's that's that's too that's a shitty question. No, that's a shitty question. No, that's But so I'm just going to ask [laughter] I'm just I just >> question though.
26:21Start listening then. I'm just so taken with your with your talent, Coleman. I I always have been and and now hearing and that's why I was so curious as to how >> how it got started in you, you know, like and I'm always interested in this cuz like I started before I even knew who I was. I started when I was such a young kid.
26:39Like this whole notion of pretending to be somebody different was like a different thing for me. And to hear that you started at at at such an older age when you knew who you were. What is it about acting that you really like? I mean, can you can you tap into like where you go when you pretend to be somebody else?
27:00Is it about exploring different sides of yourself and people just get to watch that? or are you conscious of the audience that is that is that is receiving this show and and and you're performing for them? Does does that make sense? >> Yeah. >> By the way, that's a really good question. >> That's a great question.
27:17It's >> not a shitty question at all. >> Yeah. [laughter] >> But you know what to try to answer. >> Mine's going to be do you have any funny theater stories? [laughter] >> We know. We know. Sean, we know anything that >> Anything with Ty Daily Coleman. >> Anything. [laughter] Oh my god. I give I give anything for a Ty Daily story.
27:36Sean was waiting for that voice. But you know, I think that honestly I feel like >> listen and and I don't want to get too sort of ariodite about it, but I do think that acting is a is a bit of a service job. It is. But yet is it's incredibly wonderful to feel like I'm very curious about other people.
27:53And I think it's also going back to my journalistic roots of like me wanting to be a journalist. I'm like I want to find out why people do what they do and if I can actually now embody it and become that person and do research. Like I played horrible people and you know I'm sure we all have. I played >> um Mist in the Color Purple or you know in um a pimp in Zola >> um >> somebody who sex traffs women.
28:14I'm like that's totally the opposite of me. I'm being such a feminist. But for me is if I find something in them and I'm like I want to find their humanity in there, right? >> And and it almost makes you feel closer to people. I guess maybe it makes me feel like honest I'll be very honest. I feel like, you know, I feel like there's nothing that, you know, I'm not somebody who really who truly believes in uh cancel culture because I always feel like there's a path and if we look into
28:37the humanity and we really find our commonalities in some way, I feel like it's something about trying to become more human and kinder and I think >> I mean also like to when you play like dark characters like that or like villains or whatever you want to call them, you know that they don't think they're villains or horrible people.
28:53So as long as they feel just they feel justified and it it's really interesting finding that part of the character to show to the audience that >> oh my god look at that look in their eyes they think they're not doing anything wrong that's a fascinating discovery as the audience is I feel like I don't I don't I like to lean into people who are so the different different than my own experience and I feel like that that brings me some joy in some way if I can tap into that I think that's a win.
29:19Well, there's you're talking about like you're also talking about nuance, too. Like it's sort of like a joy of nu There's such a loss of nuance now. Uh you know, I don't think that people and that's kind of the beauty of life is right. It's like what are the things that make us there like what why are you could like as you said with Joe Jack like you could look at him in a binary way.
29:36You could go he did X Y and Z and then he and he was but no but why there was a thing and he had re in his mind he believed it and that's kind of interesting. You don't have to agree with it, but it's interesting >> cuz I love all the questions around it because I feel like I think I listen, I can say it to you guys.
29:50I respect you guys so much and I've seen all of your work and I feel like part of this work that I love so much is the research and the detailing and finding the nuances and finding out what makes them tick and and where they live in your body, you know, where they live in your soul in some way, shape, or form.
30:05I think that's it's incredibly selfish in a way, too. I feel like that's for me. I want to I want to unpack all that good stuff, you know. Um the difference between the your process in the in the doing a character on stage uh over a period of months versus uh doing a film or uh a series or something like that where you're doing that one scene that day and you'll never do it again.
30:26Um uh affects sort of your ability to kind of like dig down and and and play different parts of that character stuff. Do you enjoy the theater process more just because you get more time with that character in those situations? You know what's interesting to me? I I like the idea because I'm still such a theater actor that like the moment I'm cast, I go into research and development.
30:48>> Really, I'm Sean, you you probably agree with this, too. Like literally, >> I can take myself through a 40-hour rehearsal week for myself before I get to set. >> You know, if I know of the work that I have to get done, I'm like, let me let me get into the gym and work this stuff out. Put on my headphones, whatever.
31:00So, when I'm on set, I'm loose. I can go anywhere with it. You know, for me, that that's what I enjoy. I don't like showing up. I don't like showing up and just like, oh, like thinking that this is going to be the moment. I'm like, no, I've already I've played it. >> Do you memorize the whole thing before day one?
31:15>> I I memorize at least 90%. >> Yeah. >> I And for me, that's that's a trick for me to feel like it's always still very new, but also I'm a person like even when we go to set um to rehearse the scene, I have the script in my hand. People who don't have the script in their hand, I'm like I I feel like I need it to still feel like it's >> I know.
31:32It makes me nervous when they don't have their script. It makes me nervous because it feels like that they already have an a way they're going to do it. And for me, I'm still trying to figure this [ __ ] out. I don't know what what Sean or Jason or Will's going to say or do. I don't know what >> I don't know how I'm going to do it till I see what you're doing, >> dude.
31:46Exactly. I'm I'm going to respond and but I've done my work, so I've been in the gym working it out. So now I can be available. And so for me, that's that's what feels good. And I like the idea of not being >> I be I It's funny. I had to talk about this with a colleague of mine a couple weeks ago. I think work should be imperfect.
32:03I I strive for the imperfections in my work and I feel like that maybe that's why I feel like >> when I when I go to set and the thing the thing that annoys me the most is when like you're work walking through the scene and then suddenly the scriptive adviser like she's like oh you know the line is you know it's fine I'm going to [ __ ] up the lines for the next like three takes but I'm going to get there >> be different on the next take too >> but but I'm going to get there I'm going
32:25to get there because I have I have an esteem for my work but I feel like I need to be raw and loose and I'm trying to figure out how this prop works or whatever. So my brain is going all over the place. >> So you said perfection in your work. Does that spill over in your in your personal life? >> Oh yeah.
32:39Imperfection. Yes. Absolutely. >> But also [laughter] what's funny cuz I I think Listen, I literally I don't know. Oh my god. Why am I telling you guys this? But I guess I I Exactly. But you know, it's funny because I think that I realized that I had something dental possibly happen to my teeth cuz I was wearing uh some fake fronts when I played by Rustin and Rustin.
33:02And I think it sort of like made my tooth a little go in and every time I see it now cuz I'm like I don't remember that. Has it gotten like that now? [laughter] Like what the [ __ ] So I look in movies and TV, what the [ __ ] is going on with my tooth? >> And now I'm just like but then also I'm just like maybe that's all right.
33:17I'm like, I should have got it fixed. But I'm like, no, it's okay that my face is supposed to change, I think. >> Right. >> You know what's cool? It's so funny you say that. I went to I went to my dentist uh a couple years ago and he goes, "You know what? Your your bottom tooth is kind of in a little bit and I'm going to get you in the uh Invisalign."
33:32And I kind of like let him I was in the chair. I'm just doing a clean and I was like, "Okay." [laughter] And I said, "Yeah." And they did the thing and I got the Invisalign. I started doing it after a couple days and then I realized and then I go I called him up. I go, "I'm done. I'm not doing it." Goes, "Well, you're going to fit."
33:46I go, "I don't care. I'm not a I'm not a tooth model, right? I don't give a [ __ ] >> Yeah. And maybe that's the thing, too, cuz I think everybody feels like everyone should be perfect and I feel like I maybe that's, you know, I feel like I maybe I want to have one of those really old craggy British faces, you know?
34:00>> Yeah. [laughter] >> Me, too. >> Yeah. Exactly. Lots of lines in my face. >> Jason, no comment. [laughter] >> No, I always I always say it's like it's a privilege to get older. Like you want to be the most wrinkled person in the world because that means you've lived a long time. The only way to avoid getting older is to die.
34:20>> So, anyone complaining [laughter] about getting old, it's like I mean, talk about a binary choice. You're either getting older or you die. Like, which do you want? >> Right. Right. Right. >> And and Right. And and we could and we can get older in a in a in a in the best way. We could take care of ourselves and what we have and all that [ __ ] but I feel like the idea of vanity, I feel like I don't want to have the vanity that like >> I don't know that's outside of my Yeah.
34:43Exactly. Yeah. I look at myself, I'm like, I look not too bad for 56. I'm doing all right, you know. There you go. >> Yeah. Same. That's how I I'm 56 as well. >> Don't you feel? >> Yeah. And I You know what I realized the other day? I was like, I've got these these are laugh lines. This means that I laugh a lot.
34:56Man, am I lucky. I like get to live my life laughing a lot. [laughter] >> Jason Jason's looking looking at plastic surgery for you right now as he's [laughter] >> No, but but just like a night light laser. I just did a light laser. Just a light laser. Right. real life. Hey, um you know, uh Coleman, I wanted to ask you about It's funny.
35:15So, you did all this stuff. I mean, you've done so many your credits are insane and and you know, all this theater and film and television and then there was that period you did you did uh uh Selma and you did uh The Butler and I read somewhere that you said after that that for a minute you felt like there wasn't as much work coming your way in film that and TV that you wanted and you almost thought of like giving up on film and TV.
35:39Is that true? Yeah. And then and then and then right and then you went right into the fear of the walking dead. Is that right about that time? >> Well, the wild thing is I was booking a lot of these sort of like you know small roles in big films like whether with um Steven Spielberg or Lee Daniels or Ava Deiver or Steven Soderberg, you name it.
35:56>> But they were looking at me from like being a theater actor in New York. I was booking this stuff when like I I would go in and sign in, you know, to go and sign in and like I had like the most boutique agent that no one ever knew about >> up against CIA and WME and all that other stuff. And so I felt like I I was rare.
36:12I was getting in there because of my theater work. And so I would go and get these smaller roles and everything >> and it was fulfilling enough. But then after I was when I was enter my mid-40s, I was about 44 years old and I went to London on the west end and did Scott Boys came back and I was getting these auditions like you know under five and I was like this doesn't make any sense and I was like living in Manhattan Plaza New York City you know rent stabilized apartment and I was like you know I was
36:40I was making it as an artist but I just thought like man I think you know I have friends who are doctors and lawyers and they have 401ks and [ __ ] and I was like I'm still living like a teenager. I'm like, maybe maybe I need to do something else. And then I had a succession of auditions that felt like they were going nowhere and they were breaking me, breaking me, breaking me.
36:56And then of course that was back when they had a pilot season. So of course there's months where >> they say you you're not supposed to go anywhere. I would just defy that [ __ ] I'm like I'm going to go [ __ ] Australia and do my solo show. [ __ ] that. So I would go into these [clears throat] meetings.
37:10>> So I was doing a lot of work and getting some minimal traction and then I just tried to make a a stronger decision. But this decision was because of after some heartbreak too. I think I was just I felt after a while I started getting disrespected from the auditions that I was the the things that I was being offered or being part of or not be a part of and I was like I just wanted to get off of it and I and I feel like I just wanted to stop before I was brokenhearted about the thing that I
37:38love the most. >> So I was going to >> And you would have gone just primarily uh exclusively to theater. >> No, I was actually going to leave the industry period. >> You were okay. What we I had I had a side hustle as a headshot photographer. >> Really? I was making money. I was doing everybody's head shot.
37:55>> Wait a second. But are people still getting >> head shot? No, this was bad. I maybe I don't know. Probably not the three probably not the four of us. Exactly. But yeah. Yeah, dude. I would do head shot like and like I like 300 bucks here, 300 bucks here. I was doing everybody's head shots in New York.
38:10>> Wait, so you'd show up with your camera and a tripod and a roll of Seamless? >> Yeah. Or would they would come with you? They were coming where they come to see [laughter] the backdrop. >> Yeah, exactly. >> Yeah, dude. I I No, I would set I would set it up in my apartment and people come over and I would do their head shots.
38:24>> [ __ ] love it, >> dude. And so I was going to rock that. >> I was going to have a headshot business and just like stay with that cuz it was lucrative. I felt artistically fulfilled. A >> great way to meet people. >> Yeah. And also I felt like again I I didn't want to be so downhearted about >> this industry cuz I loved it so much.
38:37So I was ready to leave it. >> So glad we didn't lose you, huh? >> Thanks. But but then but then like like you're saying but then like I had to do some strategic things like I >> as I was leaving this industry one of my dearest friends uh Daniel Breaker he said hey you know my managers have been wanting to meet with you for a long time and I was like nah I'm good I'm I just let go of my manager I'm letting go of my agent next week.
38:57He said just meet with him and I went in there and I was the I was not my most effervescent self. I really sat there arms folded and just like they were like so tell us about your this is what I do. I do this this but I just it was a bad bad meeting for me >> and they were like well we love to take you on.
39:16I said all right let's see let's see if we can give it six months and see what happens. >> Yeah. >> And literally they said the first thing we have to do we have to change your agent and so I was um my literary agent was at Gersh and they and then eventually they moved me over to Gersh and I went to for my first couple auditions because I knew this is what I knew.
39:35I knew that my auditions weren't being seen. I knew I really knew how to do a good self tape, but I had no access or agency. >> So, yeah, >> literally within a month, I booked Fear of the Walking Dead >> and uh Bos Lurman's The Get Down. Uh so, two series leads. I had to choose. I had to make a Sophie's choice and I chose the thing that was the weirdest thing because that's me.
39:57I chose Fear of the Walking Dead. I'm like, what is that? I didn't know about The Walking Dead or anything, >> but um I was like, I feel like I want to go on that road to figure out this character. the character was written. He was written like you know Richard the third his first monologue and I was like oh this is interesting and then I went on to do that show for eight seasons and I was the longest running character on there >> in directing too JC.
40:18>> Oh then I directed and produced it. Yeah. >> The new the new agent pushed those auditions through and got them >> seen. Oh yeah because also this new agent um her name was Elizabeth Wersstein and she she said uh I have an audition for you for something for it's a Walking Dead franchise and I was like I don't even know know what that is.
40:34Again, I was a bit more a bit of a snob to be honest when it comes to television work cuz I didn't think at the time they were writing at least for this face >> very complex roles, you know, for for so I usually >> I mean my experience with television up to then was being, you know, auditioning for every episode of like Nash Bridges or something playing a character called too cool Tyrell.
40:54>> Um, [laughter] you know what I mean? So, so I just like I gave up on that. I'm like, no, they're not writing for me. I think I can do better work in the theater, you know? >> Right. I get it. So then you started directing Fear of the Walking Dead. Yeah. I started directing and producing. Amazing. >> But listen, I But listen, you know why?
41:08Because >> I'm someone like because I think maybe it's the way I was built. It's like I walk into a room, I can't just be an actor. I've got to figure out how are we doing this whole thing? How are we making it? And so I >> that came from Gayan Hurd. She came and saw >> on a hiatus. I was directing a production of Robert O'Hara's barbecue at the Geffin Playhouse.
41:27And I invited my executive producer Gayen Hurd to come and see it. And she says, "Have you ever thought about directing TV?" And I was like, "Not really." And she says, "I think you >> again, someone else says it to me. I think you [clears throat] may have a skill set for that." >> And so I said, I I was curious about it.
41:43So I started shadowing on my own show for the next year. And then they gave me my first episodes to direct. >> How did you like it? Was it comfortable? >> I loved it. I think you love it too, don't you? Cuz you're you're a beautiful director, man. I love it. I love it. So how would you did you So you had been directing in the theater, but now you've got now you got a camera.
41:58Um, and now you have to guide the audience's perspective and all that stuff and lenses and lighting and all that stuff. Was that Did you have a good partner? Uh, >> I did. I at first cinematically did like Andrew Bernstein who's a beautiful television. >> Oh my god, I love Andrew. >> Isn't Andrew wonderful?
42:13[clears throat] He really was he really was my mentor in many ways and really just like >> isn't he a sweet man? >> He's a sweetheart and so talented. And so I I was just working with these guys who were like willing to give me any amount of information. Talk about lenses, talk about lighting, talk about you name it.
42:27how to tell the story, how to prep. >> Sure. >> And I just like I just soaked it all in, man. And then it just felt right and natural. But also what I love about maybe this is what I love because I'm I direct on my show now fear on four seasons. What I love is being sort of the cheerleader >> for all these smart people >> and coming up with a vision and saying we're going to get behind this.
42:45I like the idea of trying to make a day. I love being up against your back against the wall. [laughter] >> You know what I mean? But I but I love the enthusiasm and the encouragement to make something happen. you know, >> have you ever wanted to develop or create something for yourself or have you? And I just don't know.
43:00>> I have. I have. We I've been Yes. And it's funny cuz we're developing something now uh for Netflix uh a show called um Heedlland's House. And so that that's for me and some >> Okay, good. Are you going to direct that, too? >> I probably It's funny. They they asked me about that, but I feel like it's it's a central character and I feel like I like the idea of sometimes laying back, letting another creative come in here.
43:21I don't want to do everything at times, you know, unless I really feel like I didn't really It's a I don't know. >> Jason, he doesn't feel the need to control everybody all the time. [laughter] Jason God. >> But what would you say? >> Sorry, Coleman. He just has to control everything. >> But what would you say about about directing yourself?
43:36Do you find it complicated or do you find the opposite? Do you find that it's efficient in that that actor is kind of reading your mind? >> It's efficient. And I also know how to I feel like you probably know this as well too. I feel like because I feel like I really know how to prep well and then also I'm okay with also you know I will have my handheld monitor take a look at that.
43:54I can judge my own performance but also I don't mind listening to my EPs and just like anything else you need and the writers whatever. So I'm collaborative in that way and so I and I know how to if something's not even happening in the scene I can be fully present in the scene and then suddenly >> okay we're going to do a pickup and like hey try this here blah blah blah whatever.
44:10I'm going to do this both and then we go again you know. Yeah. No, you're I love it, you know. Don't you But don't you do the same thing, Jason? How do you feel? >> I can't I cannot get enough of it. It's just It's a high. Yeah. And I don't know. I mean, yeah, but like thank God, you know, that that you know, speak for the four of us here that we're at a point in our in our careers.
44:27Thank God that um our our ambition is matched with our access. you know that you know you were speaking earlier about you know all the talented friends that you have and maybe are without access like like you were at one point. My heart breaks for those people. There's so many people that are incredibly talented far more talented than some that are that are enjoying success that just simply can't get in the door.
44:52They can't get their tape seen. >> Well well think about Yeah. Think about Coleman how long you he he you just described how long it took. You were in your 40s. You were doing all you built all this. I was thinking about you built this incredible career. You have this in in incredible CV of all these different roles and in in various things in film and TV and stage and then you do Euphoria and for whatever reason because that show is is just such a part of the sort of culturally part of the fabric
45:21right now. That show is so popular >> and it feels like that was the show was like kind of you're coming out to a broader audience and everybody's like Coleman Domingo is amazing and you win the Emmy and all this sort of stuff and you're like hey man I've been building this [ __ ] for 25 [laughter] years.
45:37>> Exactly. >> Right. A little bit overnight success. Yeah. >> It kind of feels that way but also it took like for me it took people like Sam Levenson and I wonder if you guys agree here. It took someone who wrote he wrote the triple axle for me. He wrote something where he thought, "Oh, Coleman can deliver this."
45:53Not something that like, "Oh, like he wrote it for me." Which is beautiful. So he he knew >> the things I could do and he also knew the things that probably scared me and I wondered if I could do, >> but he g but he believes in me. So which that that's what feels good. And I feel like the things that I started to get more recognition for, I've really been under the hood with whether it's um the film Rustin or something like that where I've I've actually been able to do the thing that I knew that I do I do best.
46:20I've never been I would always say this and I I wonder if you guys agree for yourselves cuz you're all multi-hyphenets. I never thought that like I'm I'm not that great to just be the actor that's hired to just like come hit the marks and leave. >> I'm like I want to know how are we making it. >> You want to contribute.
46:36>> Yeah. I want to contribute. How are we making this? I Exactly. I want I want to I show up to you know sometimes I'll show up to set and just I want to see how things are. I want to watch how we're doing that scene. I want to know how the engine my engine will work with that as well. But also, I'm just curious about the whole process, you know?
46:50>> Yeah. Which makes you a better soldier, right? I mean, if you know what's going on in other departments, Yeah. you can figure out how to maybe fill in the margins a little bit when when appropriate. >> Absolutely. Absolutely. That feels good. >> We'll be right back. And back to the show. It sounds, you know, you were saying before you you you spent so long living like a teenager.
47:13When um when stuff really started to change for you, how did you were you comfortable with the integration of a a different a different rhythm of life both both in in time and also in in luxury and in travel and in um and and and and and privacy and and all those things. How is how is success um uh wearing on you?
47:37That's a great question and I think even in the last few years I've had to make some new agreements in a way. >> Yeah. >> One was even when where I live now, I live in this gated community in Malibu and I didn't know I needed it. I [clears throat] I went to um actually Denzel Washington's house. He was renting a house up in Malibu and it was after I was nominated for Rustin and he said uh he said hey so u and we were hanging out for like 3 hours and he says um I said well I got to get back to I
48:06was living in Downey um this little suburban town and lovely neighbors knew me. Yeah, exactly. Southeast LA and I loved it and I lived there for like eight years while I've been on shows and stuff like that. >> And I said uh oh I'm heading back home. He said where do you live? I said I live in Downey.
48:21He said what's that? I said oh it's a little southeast suburb. He's like, "Hm, you've been there for a while?" I was like, "Yeah." He said, "You have gate." I was like, "Yeah, I have gate." He says, "Uh, you know, you're going to have to move, right?" >> And I said, >> "Why?" And he said, "You'll notice that things change and you'll need you'll need a little less access and you have to figure you have to navigate that for yourself, how you have access."
48:42And he was right cuz things start to change where I realized I needed more privacy to just be >> and to just and for me where I live now, it's like really just like I really just get to be and just be a person and not be That's so nice. >> Not being an actor or anything like like the the the question that I I >> that I still navigate when whenever I see somebody on the words like, "Hey, what are you up to?"
49:02I'm like, >> "Oh, I'm just [clears throat] going for a walk here." But they want to know your CV, what you're up to. I'm like, "No, that's actually not me all day long." You know what I mean? Or like, >> and I feel like >> it it is >> I've learned because I think because it's happened later for me. Um, first of all, I'm extremely grateful and I'm so happy that when people see me, I know I get something that a lot of people don't.
49:25People want to hug me all the time. They people like, "Oh my god, could I have a hug?" I I've never and really and my colleagues are like, they're like, "Wow, pe people want to hug you." Whatever that is that I give off, I feel like I'm very grateful for that that people want to connect like that. But also, >> well, you're not an [ __ ] >> No, no, no, no.
49:42I try, you know, I try every day to be a good person. You know what I mean? Like characters. You you've done you you've had like a such a run of like enormously emotionally demanding performances that you've delivered like just with a plum, shall I say? And and yeah, and and I think that that probably translate I I think that that probably speaks to I'm asking more.
50:03Uh are are these the kind of things that you look for now? you because it seems to me talking to you that you're a person who is looking for that kind of emotional connection constantly. >> I I I am I think that's maybe that's it that all makes sense to me. I feel like I I can even >> you know we we start getting to these ages where sometimes you get like sort of a retrospective of your work that you're supposed to talk about and you're like oh my god I can now see the thread
50:30that I'm I'm >> interested in being deeply human and and connecting with other people. And I feel like that that's in everything that I do. I feel like the the blessing is I was able to now doing the show four seasons that makes me feel like there's a bit more of a light-hearted humor and I don't have to sort of carry the weight because I know that I'm sure we all I we go deep when we go like into a deeper expression of human pain or anxiety and I feel like I'd been doing that for so
50:56long. I said I need to just look wear a cute sweater and give way banter. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> I mean, you got but but then you've got you've got Tina Fay. You got Tina F. awful [laughter] the Tina. >> Isn't she horrible Tina? >> She's not smart and talented and funny at all. >> Steve will even all these people are just >> What about that original Four Seasons?
51:22The film is one of my favorite favorite. >> Okay. You and I. Okay. You me you all of us. Tina Fay, we were like what, 10, watching that movie. Why were we watching that movie when we were that age? >> Because because I think cable had just kind of gotten started and it was one of those films that was in a prison rotation.
51:39>> Uhhuh. >> Yeah. And and I just and then all the you know the Vivaldi all the way through it obviously. I was just like >> But we were kids watching I guess watching a show about like our parents or something. >> There's a lot of those like ordinary people we watch. >> Yeah. I watched that all the time.
51:53>> Yeah. Alan Alda and and Jack was was Jack Weston. >> Jack Weston. Exactly. Yeah. And uh I just >> Rita Moreno Coleman. >> Yeah. Go ahead, Sean. I I was going to say go ahead, but do you mind if I just ask this? It occurs to me as you sort of talk about this and being of a certain age. We're all of a certain age here in in our mid to late 50s, shall we say?
52:14All of us could play late 40s, by the way. >> Without a doubt without a doubt with good light with [laughter] good lighting. Yeah. You see, I was adjusting this lighting with a bounce. >> In the beginning, I was adjusting this like crazy. I was like, let me get it with a bounce >> with a bounce card under, you know.
52:29[laughter] Um, and I might have Jason, you might have to Hollywood it underneath a frame. >> Just fly it in there. Sure. >> But yes, [laughter] but but is there anything like in your life like I I've been going through this thing being now being 56. I I I there's so many uh just kind of things that I've laid down that I've just stopped that I've sort of like it's taken me a long time to kind of get there.
52:51And I was wondering do you have you guys been noticing that that you're just like >> stripping stuff away, >> letting go of [ __ ] that you don't do anymore? >> Yeah. Yeah, for sure. >> Like I'm I'm way less judgmental than I was 2 years ago. I I'll go for way less judgmental than I was 2 years ago. And I see it so much and I'll be in a conversation with somebody.
53:07I'll go, "Does it need to be said? Does it need to be said right now? Does it need to be said by me? Like I just kind of let it go. >> Yeah. You because you you don't have to comment on everything either. You just like, "Okay, cool. Is that the way you feel?" Cool. Great. Do you guys feel that way? >> Yes.
53:21Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I do find Willie, building on yours, I I found that I'm I'm trying to be less judgmental in a way of just it's sort of a lazy crutch for conversation, you know? Like I rarely s I'm rarely sincere about my judgment and it's more about like oh well let's just bond kind of like [ __ ] dragging this person and talking [ __ ] about this film or or or this like like for some reason criticism kind of became kind of >> great.
53:51Yeah. Yeah. Ex go. Exactly. Another another term for it. Exactly. Just as like well it's it's it's you feel like you're getting closer with that other person or you're signaling to that other person. Hey, we it's just between you and me or we're getting closer and and it's kind of a you know it's it's lazy.
54:08Um uh to be honest. So yeah. So >> and you feel shitty. >> Yeah. Yeah. When you don't even believe it and you you're not you don't mean it. It's just like well instead of coming up with something that could bond you that's a little bit more positive on a different subject. I'm now I'm now reaching for that.
54:25>> Let me tell you guys something. About a few years ago I was walking around with this this older woman >> and she said, "Well, how old are you?" I said, uh, I'm was at that time I was like 52 or something. She says, "Oh, okay. You're in your storytelling season." I said, "What's next?" She says, "Right now, you're it's important for you to tell a story.
54:39Tell a story about yourself that that lasts you until your 50s." >> I said, "When you hit your mid-50s to early 60s, you move into your truthtelling season." I was like, "What's that?" She says, >> "If you don't want to do something, you just say no." I said, "Wait, just no?" She said, I said, "No qualifier."
54:52She says, "You just say no >> because you're not responsible." >> Yeah. >> For the way other people feel about something. >> I love that. Isn't that dope? So, I was like, I move. So, I sort of jettisoned right to that that [laughter] season. I was like, I'm gonna move right there. That's that feels good.
55:09>> I've told enough stories. I'd like to get into the truth telling. >> Exactly. [laughter] Yeah. No is a fine Yeah. No is a fine answer as long as you as you say it in a kind way. Just take a just take a second to just message it the right way and and then it gets received the way you >> intend. Yeah.
55:21You know, I I quit like um I've kind of if people come over for dinner, like I have friends that I haven't seen or people in the business or whatever and they have a dinner at my house. I used to be like, "Oh, shoot. How do you get to how do you get them out of your house?" Cuz it's different than going to a restaurant.
55:34Cuz in a restaurant, the check is the end of the of the night, but when they come over, they could be there for five hours, they could be an hour. Like, you don't know. So now I'm at the age I just go, "Guys, I'm going to bed. Thank you." [laughter] >> I mean, that's it. >> I've literally got to go to bed.
55:49Do you guys know Chris Harwick? I've been to his literally I watched him one day. He we were sitting around outside. It was wonderful and lovely. He goes up he comes down like in pajamas and he starts he starts turning the lights. That's my move. >> You do that move is just [laughter] is to go up go upstairs and change and come back down turn on the LIGHTS LIKE WHAT >> EXACTLY what [laughter] Sean you'd love Sean.
56:10By the way, Coleman I always say that Sean is he's he always wants to be uh only like in the place that he's not in now. He always wants to be somewhere else. But I will say this, Sean. I I I found this restaurant. I have a lot of anxiety [laughter] >> on Long Island with the kids. >> Sure. Anxiety. Um and I I went to this restaurant.
56:29I found And they had on the table a QR code, so you could eat your dinner. And then they were like, "Oh." And I I I hit the QR code and you can just selfch checkckout, do the tip, do everything right there. You don't have to have the waiter come over. And it became my favorite place to go this summer cuz I'd go with the kids, we'd eat, and I'd be like, "Boom, we're out."
56:46>> That's fantastic. No more nices. No more asking for the check. >> No more waiting. Then they go, they bring it back in the thing and they >> they need that in Europe for real. They need that in Europe because you can never get a check. >> I know. That's exactly right. I just when I was in London last year, how many trips back and forth are we doing till I pay the thing?
57:02It's endless. >> Wait, Coleman, do you have any horrible gone wrong theater stories? We need one before. >> Just like one like something where like the set collapsed or somebody vomited audience passed or anything [laughter] like that? Somebody That's what a real funny one. >> Hilarious one. Somebody had a stroke in the middle of a scene.
57:21No. No. No. Um. No. Well, no. My my story. No. I don't know if I've >> That's okay. >> About going up on a line. >> No, buddy. I won't say this, but I had Okay. In and in in London. Listen, people do things a little differently on stage. Like they will go in between shows, if you're an old school actor, you'll go to the pub >> and come back completely pissed doing the show.
57:43And I'm like, and I look at my fellow actor, I'm like, he's his face is beat red. I'm like, this this dude is drunk. >> Yeah. And he would go up on his lines. My lines were always after his. I'm like, this [ __ ] you [laughter] constantly saving the scene. I'm like, oh my god. But really, but it was okay with him because I'm like, because he is a legendary actor and he just was a little drunk, but they they're like they're like, "Yeah, what are you going to do?
58:05He But they were all like cool about it." They're like, "He went to the pub." I'm like, "Wait, that's not that >> Did I hear you say you've got a you got a oneman show that you do sometimes? Do you ever fear um uh going up on your lines when you got no one out there to help you? >> Oh, I did go up on my lines.
58:16I went up all my lines at the Venue Theater and it it devastated me. I was mortified. But I went up twice because I went up on the same thing. I had to restart the show and then I went up again. But I realized, okay, this is not to bring the mood down. I realized it was the anniversary of my parents passing and the show that I was doing was all about my family.
58:33And then I thought I was performing the show beautifully, but suddenly something clicked and was like, "Oh no, you have to feel the show." And I kept going up and then I was racing through the show to get to the end. I was like cuz I I was on adrenaline. I'm like I can't go up on lines. So I was performing probably like a [ __ ] maniac for like 90 minutes.
58:49I left that show and I was just like oh my god. Oh my god. I felt like crazy cuz I'd never gone up on a show. But then I realized >> and my own, you know, psychotherapy that I was like, "Oh, I'm not actually dealing with this event that I don't have my parents anymore." And >> Yeah. Exactly. >> And the next night you were okay.
59:08>> Yeah. And the next night I was okay. But but to me to be honest there was a breakthrough because I realized >> and the beautiful thing is sometimes you have these breakthroughs as we do have performers you're like oh I was performing it I wasn't really living it so now I have to live it >> and that was the joy cuz suddenly had a breakthrough and it it changed me as a performer as well.
59:24It was like you'll have a better chance of remembering all your lines if you're living it as opposed to performing it. Okay. >> Absolutely. >> Yeah. Because you have no choice because because everything makes sense that you're saying. >> Yeah. Got it. >> You're not trying to like Right. You're not trying to just >> I was doing it more for it was more outside in instead of inside out.
59:39And so I feel like that >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> But but also I think that those mishaps, any mishaps we have in our work, I I really try to look at it's that magic is that thing that like you'll never get back and you're like, but if we lean into it, it's something that can transform you, you know? >> Yeah, for sure.
59:56>> Yeah. Well, it goes back Yeah. the the imperfection, the thing that that where it's not it's not corporate. You're not trying to hit something. You're not. It's just like the it's it's the beauty of the thing and and the and the most beautiful things are imperfect in that way. >> Yeah. Coleman, I said this I said this story before, but um the one man show I just did I you know you're playing 10 different people and the line was I buzz the door and Larry answers right is one
1:00:20of my lines. And then I go into Larry who a different person and I was actually was like show 60 70 whatever and I was actually waiting for whoever was playing Larry to talk [laughter] and I was like and I cuz my mind I just check I checked out you know what I mean? I was like I buzz the door Larry answers and I was just waiting for I go oh [ __ ] I'm Larry I'm Larry [laughter] too.
1:00:42>> Oh it's me. Oh it's me. >> I'm Larry. It was crazy. >> Oh my god. Anyway, >> I think solo shows are the are the most terrifying things though to be honest. Like like standard comedy as well. >> Yeah. >> I mean, I feel like we could talk to you forever. You are. What a delight to get to know you, man.
1:00:59Honestly, just been such a fan for such a long time. So, it's just really a thrill to have. >> Well, I love this because I I really admire and like adore you guys so much and I was like hang out with them and like, you know, hopefully become friends, you know. >> Well, we'll do it in person. And when I see you, I'm going to hug you.
1:01:16>> Please hug me. >> Yeah, me too. I'm going hug [laughter] you. It'll be a huddle. >> By the way, we're looking for more friends. We're looking for more friends. So, you better you better be >> I'm in. I'm in. I'm in. >> Great. Thank you guys. Thank you for coming on. Thank you. You guys are wonderful.
1:01:29>> All right, pal. Have a great day. Bye. Bye. >> See you later. Bye. >> How great is he? >> Well, yeah. I was so glad you brought him on, Will. >> Yeah, the energy. I love his energy. >> He's just He's just got so much. to me is just like that guy is that guy's an artist, man. >> Yeah, >> that dude's an artist.
1:01:47That guy. >> Do you guys believe in like and and and I'm, you know, I'm here looking at a computer here. Um >> that I was you still feeling like I don't mean to sound all uh uh uh you know, unicorns and and uh rainbows, but like that there was a vibe. Do you guys feel like that you get a vibe from somebody and then like that that person's a match for you?
1:02:10I would get along with that person. You know, when it happens in person, >> you just end up always getting on with that person. It's not because of anything they particular said or it's just it's just a vibe. And like do you think that that's like a real thing or is it am I just a dingo? >> No, I mean that's that's why that's why you create a relationship with somebody, right?
1:02:30>> But like is it animal? You know, like because I feel like, you know, without communication, I feel like animals do that. You ever see like like dogs when they just like stare at each other and they'll like they'll start like [laughter] like immediately just like but it's not they're not giving any any signal or any words beforehand.
1:02:43Like is there some sort of a silent communication that that exists between two beings at times that are a match or not match? >> I think so. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I think so, man. Hey, dude. Are you going through something right now? [laughter] >> If you guys could just call me after this. [laughter] Um, by the way, by the way, what if you're what if you're like what if you're like, "Yeah, I feel that."
1:03:08And then you like you got his number and you're like, "Hey, Coleman, man, I feel like we should hang out." He was like, "Yeah, just sorry, man. I'm not feeling." [laughter] >> You know what's so funny? By the way, I didn't even I didn't even realize um we were both in The Running Man, the Edgar Wright movie, right?
1:03:20And when when when Edgar said I forgot to bring it up, but when Edgar called me, he's like, "Do you want to play the game show host?" I was like, "Oh my god, yeah, that's such a great part." And then he I got the script and it was just the opening game show host and Coleman played the game show host more specific.
1:03:38>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But he was fantastic in that too. He >> always is never terrible. >> Um but you know he he's very >> Oh boy. By the way [laughter] God God >> you got to get better. So embarrassing for you. It's always the same. >> I know it is. >> But because he goes like this but he goes and you see him looking.
1:03:55He goes but you know >> Yeah. And then he looks on his computer where he's sort of halfway written it out. Go ahead. >> Right. So, um, you know, he's in The Walking Dead or The Fear The Walking Dead, you know. >> Yes. >> And he's in a very famous episode called Days Gone. [snorts] >> Bye. >> God, you had to dig deep for [laughter] that one.
1:04:18Bye. >> Smart less. Smart [music] glass >> smart list is 100% organic and artisally handcrafted by [music] Rob Armjarf, Bennett Barbco, and Michael Grant Terry. Smart less.
More SmartLess transcripts
- Ray Winstone | SmartLess
- Jessica Biel | SmartLess
- RE-RELEASE: Ben Affleck | SmartLess
- Michael Douglas | SmartLess
- Seth Meyers | SmartLess
- Benny Blanco | SmartLess
The transcript comes from the captions YouTube has for this video, and the summary is written by AI, so both can contain mistakes. Creators can ask us to remove a transcript on the contact page.
← Transcribe another video